How to Check the Legality of Your House

[flimflam]

We could all try to check the legality of our homes and the Junta could still decide that our house has drawn the short straw and has to be demolished.
It seems as random as that!!!!!!!! :yawn

What Idiots we were!!!!!! :hat

The Spanish Government and the E.U. ought to get of their '*****' and do something about it!!!!!!! :dance

[Roger]

I do not have a copy of the document from the Junta.
However I have a copy of a minute from Arboleas Town Hall, from the then Town Hall architect, Francisco Martinez Moreno, Plaza Nueva 5, Albox.
The letter from the architect is dated 16 April 1998.
The Town Hall document is headed Normas Subsidiarias de Arboleas.
Capitulo 2.
Articulo 11.2.2

This clearly states the rules for building.
viz. Only allowed within 80 metres of an existing building in a Nucleo de Poblacion de Suelo No Urbanizable.
This I was told means an existing village.
It also states that you need a minimum of 500 square metres and must not be more that 50% of the land.

My land was signed off by the Town Hall architect as being in accordance with this rule.
The architect told me this was a decision of Arboleas Town Council in accordance with a general Norm issued by the Junta.

Of course I do not know what other Town Councils did about this Junta Norm.
It may be if they did not include it in their own Normas then it may not apply.

I was and am only interested in Arboleas..
I am aware that because of political dogma some Town Councils have previously ignored rules and advise from the Junta.

[Tasony]

Roger, in answer to the post from Lew A, could you quote the section of planning law which covers this 80 metre provision,and what is it that constitutes an existing village.  It may be something we can use when talking with the Junta about the process of legalising houses.

[Lew A]

Is it true that the Junta gave blanket permission for properties to be built within 80 metres of an existing village?

As I live close to the La Alfoquia Guardia Civile it could make me feel a lot happier!!  Could even make for a happy new year barring euro/£ rate, rising heating costs etc etc

[digifidd]

There may be a relationship between the Catastral office (Hacienda/Tax office in Almeria) and the Land Registry but it is not a very effective one.

For example, we have a house registered at the Hueral Overa Land Registry and our Catastral reference from Almeria states that our house is built on Urban land, so technically we legally own our house and land according to their systems.

However:

1.  The GPS co-ordinates on our Escritura/Catastral ref bear no resemblance to where our house is in reality.  The Catastral office topographers/cartographers have put our house half way up a nearby small mountain (on urban land of course), however, our actual house is sitting on a plot of land that comes under our Spanish neighbour/developers catastral reference - that is still agrarian/rustico!

2.  Our house is not considered legal by the local Ayuntamiento (Albox) as it has been built on rural land, without permissions and so no licenses.  The details from the Catastral say that we have urban land so we are paying IBI to an Ayuntamiento that do not consider us legal.  Bizarre!

Unfortunately, neither the Catastral office or the Land Registry offices seem to communicate effectively when it matters, ie they do not seem to check with the local Town Halls prior to granting building references or fully registering a property to see if permissions/licenses have been granted.
Neither do notaries, who are supposed to have all the relevant paperwork before them, prior to  letting a house purchase/sale go through.
 
These are major flaws in the system as far as I am concerned.

So it is possible to have legal houses that have Catastral references  but are not registered.  This comes down to money as usual.

Historically, Spanish families would pass properties down within the family hence no need to get them registered and so no need to pay the taxes!  It is only when the property passes out of the family that this charge is passed on to the buyer - of course!  It doesn't mean the property is illegal.  But these are usually quite old properties (15 year plus).

The recent problems (the last 5 to 10 years) have arisen when a builder/developer gets a Catastral reference, builds a new house or houses, without permissions and on the wrong type of land (no checks are done it would seem) and when built, the property is sold - again without much regulation (this may be better now as long as your estate agent is above board and knows what they are doing).  Before the property can be registered the taxes need to be paid.  There's the rub, no developer/builder wants the financial outlay so they dont get the property registered and this charge is passed onto the buyer when the house is then bought.  In buying the property through the notary, it gets filed for registration and the taxes are paid.

One would think that at the time of going to a solicitor (when contemplating a purchase), the solicitor (whether asked or not) would check to make sure a new house is built on the right type of land, ie urbano, that it was granted correct building permissions from the local town hall, had a signed off architects project plan and had been given all the relevant licenses BEFORE being sold.  Apparently not!!  This has been another contributory factor in the Almanzora Valley housing problems.

So as you can see, it is possible to have a Catastral ref that says your house is built on the right type of land, it is also possible to have a registered escritura saying that someone has paid the taxes and are the legal owners of land and house.

However, this does not mean that it IS legal.

So I would endorse what Tasony and JoMo are saying.  Do some leg work check out the type of land where your house actually is on the site given above (it links through to the Catastral site and throws out Catastral references where applicable).

Then if you have concerns, go to the local Town Hall Urbanismo office.  Ask straight forward questions and try to get similar type answers to questions like, is my house built on the right type of land, does it have permissions, licenses and is it totally legal?  Dont be fobbed off with vague, wishy washy answers - the legality of your house and your financial security depends on it.  Tell them exactly where your house is and who built it or arranged for it to be built.  They'll know if it is illegal or not, however if you dont ask, they wont offer the information.

Peace of mind and financial security are what it is all about - without it, life is hell - believe me!

[JoMo]

Hi Roger,
As the catastral is the land and property registry one can only hope that there IS a relationship between the registry and the legality of your house.!

What Tasony describes is the best method of checking the status of a NEW BUILD house. ie. not a restored cortijo or a structure built for agricultural purposes (ie a working farm). These dwelling will have the paperwork as you describe.

However, I have seen court papers which refer directly to the designation of the land as stated on the catastral register when bringing charges against a property or its owner. So... personally, I would perfer to check the designation of the land on which my house was built and then go and ask some questions of my town council. If they can re-assure you...great! Unfortunatly, mine couldn't.

Now... before you get too cross at me Roger... I have to say that it is good to see the effort that Arboleas town hall is making to ensure that the homeowner is kept informed about the inspection. I wish the others were the same.

[Roger]

This contribution is misleading and not accurate.
It assumes that there is a correlation between the Catastral records and the legal status of a property.
There is not.

I can give some specific examples.
1.  In the 1990's the Junta approved a blanket provision to allow the building of new houses within a 80 metre radius of an existing village.
     Thus houses built to this rule are legal, even though there are many examples of the Catastral not yet registering them.
2.  I know of houses which have all the documents, including a catastral registration, but are outside the approved PGOU line.
3.. There are very many houses which have been built within an approved PGOU line and are therefore legal, but the Catastral office have not yet registered them because it is a very low priority for the company which has been sub contracted to do the work.

The only solution to this problem is to make sure that your property is included in the register which local councils are currently compiling.
This way the documents, PGOU and Catastral, can be brought into line with the reality on the ground. (Unless of course you are unlucky enough to have a house which is not yet completed or which is deemed to be in an unsafe location, and you will only find this out once your Council has completed the registration process).

[Tasony]

If you are not sure whether your house is legal or not, here is a tool you can use to check the designation of your land.

http://www.goolzoom.com

You will need to change´Dirreccion´ to   ´Poligno y parcela´           (Drop down box)

Change Provincia to ´Almeria´                                                      (Drop down box)

Change ´Municipio´to Albox, or Cantoria or Zurgena or whereever you are.               (Drop down box)

You will then need to enter your poligno no. and parcela no.  

Then enter ´Buscar´

A screen should come up showing your plot.  There should also be an overlay box.  If you scroll down in the overlay box  You will see´Localizacion´, you can check you entered the details correctly and the next line is ´Clase´,  if the entry on this line is ´Rustica´, your house is not legal.

If you don´t know your poligno and parcela, there is a good chance your house is not legal as you do not have the paperwork to get the numbers from, but you can drill down and try to find your house then lookfor the ´Clase´ of your land.

It doesn´t matter whether you have mains electric or water, and even if you have a first certificate of habitation, if you are on rustic land your house is not legal.

If your  house is not legal, you need to be supporting the march on the 9th Jan in Almeria.

You can ignore it all you like, but if you don´t do anything about it, then you can just sit back and wait for the bills for legalisation to arrive.  Quite frankly, I don´t particularly wish to pay thousands of euros to get my house legalised, and I am sure you don´t either, but you will have to unless we take a stand against the Junta