Lack of consideration

[Sandancer]

Can anyone tell me what part of Limaria is affected, I have a home in Limaria and although I have all the legal papers, 1st occupation, escuituria, electric, water, build lic etc I still dont feel that I can relax in the knowledge that everything is in order as the Spanish government, councils etc seem to keep moving the boundaries and it is the Brits who always seem to lose out.

What really annoys me is in the UK everything is centred about ones human rights and as part of the EU surely in Spain, we still should have the same human rights, the right not to be ripped off by builders, lawyers, corrupt councils etc.and if you are then it should be up to the government to put that right and not at the cost of the innocent.

Most people paid in good faith for property they believed to be legal, employing a solicitor to to check all the necessary documents to ensure this was the case, only to find the builder, solicitor, local council etc etc were not as they should be.

I think we all need to stand together not only the people who know they have illegal homes but also people like myself who think/hope/believe everything is in order as I feel the Spanish government be it local or otherwise can turn that around and change the law to suit themselves and it is us who will be left to pick up the bill. ie if the builders go out of business the homeowners will have to pay for the infacstructure not the councils or government, so the home owner pays the penalty yet again!!


As has previously been stated we need to do something about it now not wait until it happens and try and change things.

[rgandrg]

You need to be on the padron to vote. If you are on the padron, go to the town hall and ask to go on the voting register. The town hall will give you a form which you need to fill in and return, this will allow you to vote in the local election and the European parliament election but not in the Spanish national elections (You will still be allowed to vote in the British national election) If you are in Arboleas I suggest you go to the town hall on a Wednesday after the 1st September and speak to Roger at the help desk I`m sure he will be only too pleased to help you with the form and he can follow it through to make sure you are entered on the electoral register. When we first went on the padron 3 years ago there was a girl working in the town hall who asked us if we wanted to go on the register and gave us a form. Consequently we have voted in 2 elections, a local one and the European one. As far as I know once you are on it you stay on it but that is a question that Roger could probably answer.

[jonaileen]

I've got a couple while you're there. What documentation is required to get on the Voter's Register and can it be done 'while you wait'?

[rgandrg]

Well folks nobody got any more questions asking for Tuesday at the town hall the topic has died, yet very vocal at the start off it.? :) ;) ;D :yawn:

[rgandrg]

Don`t know the answer to that one, thanks for the comment, gives me another question for Tuesday

[digifidd]

It is up to people in the named areas to go into the town hall to ascertain whether or not their particular plot IS going to be made urban!!!!

Just to clarify, does your last statement mean made "urban" or "urbanisable"?  The first one suggests that the plot will be included in the urban nucleus and so made urbano immediately, the second is the process by which land owners can be made urban but at a cost to themselves.

Does your agent make the difference?  Sorry to be picky.

[rgandrg]

Hi folks our agent has been to the town hall today and we have to meet them at the town hall on Tuesday to identiy our plot and it does not mean that all areas on the areas named that all plots will be made legal and urbanised.Which means that although urbanisations have been named as going urban - not all houses in that urbanisation will be going legal. It is up to people in the named areas to go into the town hall to ascertain whether or not their particular plot IS going to be made urban!!!!

[kaths1]

rganddrg,

The dates I have quoted are the dates that they were 'published' on the BOP.

The BOP is the Diputation of Almeria official site for public notices.

kaths1

[rgandrg]

Sorry Kaths but do'nt understand where you get the dates from that you have quoted, the dates our agent have told us it's from the 16th of July for 4 weeks

[kaths1]

Hi,

According to Juliet's translation of the letter you have one month from publication on the BOP. The notifications appear to have been published on 22nd July(No 139) and 29th July (No 144) respectively.

If this is the case then you have just a little more time to place objections. I am sorry but I am unable to translate the notices but they can be seen at www.dipalme.org

Hope this helps.

[rgandrg]

Hi Andy we have had dealings with the person you suggested, when we bought over three years ago a friend of came up here looked at the place and said it was not legall ( or iregular) contacted our leal team and have it in black and white that no it was not and they would not allow us to buy a propertie like that, the person you suggested basically did'nt want to know unless we paid one big sum of money. Who do you trust

[rgandrg]

Thank you Juliet P for the translation. We have an agent going into the townhall tomorrow to try and find out more information. We do not know if what the townhall have done is to our advantage or not. We still think that the Brits should stand up and be counted as far as registering to vote is concerned and we will plug this as long as it is necessary. I lived in Yorkshire as a young man and my nearest city was Bradford, that city bacame a Mecca for Pakistanis and they wouldn`t stand for being marginalised. They were the majority and became enfranchised, consequently they controlled the city. All signs were in three languages and they had a Pakistani mayor. I`m not suggesting we go to those lengths - yet but we need to be represented on the council.

[Juliet P]

In the full session of Arboleas Town Hall on 14 July 2009, agreement was reached to, among other things, give initial approval to the technical project entitled "New project of Arboleas's PGOU', written by the arquitect Francisco Martinez Moreno, that is related to the New Plan number 3, which corresponds to the 2009 version of the aforementioned PGOU of this town and relates to the following areas: Los Torres, La Perla and El Prado, and Limaria.
In line with the procedure set out in article 7 of Decree 11/2008 (of 22 January) and 36, in relation to articles 32 and 39, all of the Law of Urban Planning of Andalucia (LOUA) 7/2002 (of 22 December) these documents will be made available to the public for the period of one month from the day after the publication of this announcement in the province's Official Bulletin.
During this period any affected person can present any suggestions or objections that they wish. Any person wishing to consult the relevant documents can do so in the Town Hall, during office hours.

Arboleas, 16 July 2009. The Mayor.

Not sure that's much more help - all the important information appears to be contained in those plans in the Town Hall!

[rgandrg]

que en sesion de Ayuntamient Pleno celebrado el dia 14 de julio de 2.009, se adoptaron entre otros, el acuerdo de aprobar inicialmente el proyecto tecnico titulado "Proyecto de Innovacion del P.G.O.U. de Arboleas", redactado por el Arquitecto D.Francisco Martinez Moreno que tiene por objecto la Innovacion numero 03, correspondiente al ejercicio 2.009de dicho Plan General de Ordenacion Urbana de este municipio, destinada a las siguientes zonas: Los Torres, La Perla y El Prado, y Limaria.
       De conformidad con lo senalado por el articulo 7 del Decreto 11/2008, de 22 de enero, y 36 en relacion con los articulos 32 y 39, todos ellos de la Ley 7/2002, de 17 de diciembre, de Ordenacion Urbanistica de Andalucia (L.O.U.A.), se somete el expedient a informacion publica durante el plazo de UN MES, todo ello contado a partir del dia siguiente al de la publicacion de este anuncio en el Boletin Oficial de la Provincia.
        Durante el indicado plazo cualquier persona legitimada podra presentar las sugerencias y reclamaciones que estime convenientes, pudiendo para ello consultar el expediente en la Secretaria del Ayuntamiento, en horario de oficina.

                                  Arboleas, a 16 de julio de 2.009

                            EL ALCALDE< Angel Jesus Garcia Martinez

This is the letter we received, sorry it took so long to copy!!!

[jonaileen]

By my reckoning the 28 days ends midnight tonight if you take the date of the letter.
Perhaps someone should object anyway today to keep within the time limit (could consider handing it to a police officer to confirm receipt as Ayuntamiento is closed. If not, posted through the letterbox and followed up first thing tomorrow morning ).
I would think the objection could be removed if we are in agreement with the proposals although I doubt it.
A photocopy of the letter with "I object to these proposals" in Spanish might suffice due to lack of time for translation.   

[rgandrg]

The letter is from the Ayuntamiento de Arboleas. It concerns irregular properties in Los Torres, La Perla, El Prado and Limaria. It is signed by the mayor(Angel Jesus Garcia Martinez) It is dated 16 July but it was only delivered to us by the local police last friday,7th August, in fact the police were around again today trying to deliver to people who were not in last friday. Sorry, we can`t scan the letter. It concerns a council meeting on 14th July when the town hall agreed to adopt certain statutes from the Grand Plan for urbanisation and says that these will be posted for one month for anyone to object to in the town hall.

[Geminis]

How convenient!!!! They send out these letters knowing full well that people will not have the time to sort it out......  Where else would this happen within the EU?

[knowall]

I see, the time has already expired.

[rgandrg]

Having recd one of these letters last friday evening  it states that anyone who wants to object have 4 weeks to do so from the 14th of July 2009

[knowall]

I always thought, Roger, that nothing can get done in Spain, in August.

... except, it seems, the production of these letters, with a 15 day deadline.

Who can get anything legally complicated done, in 15 days, in the middle of August?

I could become a cynic more cynical if I wasn't careful.

[Juliet P]

If someone can scan or copy the letter on here, I'm happy to translate it.

Juliet

[Roger]

Arboleas Town Hall has just sent out letters to around 100 British households, informing them of action being taken in September to bring some land from Rural to Urbanisable.