Barking dogs, Guardia Civil, Rat-poison or???

[APACHE]

It's spain, the sun shines,dogs bark, and goats walk the roads,get used to it or move back home

SELISH

[zilnor]

hartc, I believe many of the Brits here would like to move back to UK, but can´t sell their properties due to the awful illegal housing situation.

[hartcjhart]

It's spain, the sun shines,dogs bark, and goats walk the roads,get used to it or move back home

[zilnor]

Albondigas   well said  :clap: :clap: :tiphat: :tiphat: :wave :wave

[Albondigas]

There is a saying along the lines of " The more I see of human beings, the more I like my dog". I agree with it.  :lol: :lol:

I would go along with that 100%

I think that Gandhi had it about right:

"The Greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated"

[keyser soze]

Just a little off topic

If you ever find any animal you suspect may have ingested rat poison an effective antidote is phylloquinone also known as VITAMIN K

If administered early enough can be very effective

[zilnor]

There is a saying along the lines of " The more I see of human beings, the more I like my dog". I agree with it.  :lol: :lol:

[openyoureyes]

The lesson to be learned here.  Don't even joke (let alone mention in a post) about administering poison, as if it's the "done thing", to a bunch of Brits (or on a forum populated mainly by Brits) most of which treat their dogs better than their human counterparts.  It is not a secret that Brits have such close relationships with their canine friends - there are few other nationalities that aren't aware of this (my Danish friends treat their dogs like members of the family just like us Brits for example).

As I have received another red card via PM, the reason I said it was a wind up was because the sentence was just thrown in the original post, much in my opinion like an intentional red rag to a bull to get us all stirred up.  As you said, it wasn't your intention but you must of had a slight inkling when typing it that it wasn't going to go unnoticed or unchallenged "however" you'd thought you'd written it.

The forum admins are always telling us to read, and read again what we type before we hit the send button.  

[zilnor]

Loafer, I agree that is a question of interpretation of  Connie´s original posting. We will have to agree (disagree) that we have  come to different conclusions.I stand by my statement that some of us, including myself, were a bit harsh on the comments she made  in her first posting. If you don´t agree, fair enough.  It is nearly midnight in the wilds of Staffordshire, so I am about to have another large glass of wine  before I fall into my bed.  :crazy: It has been a lovely warm and sunny day here.  I hope to be back in el compo de Partaloa in a month or so.
Viva Espana !!! :wave :wave :wave 

[livin-doll]

Definitely - totally agree with you - give up now before we all go "BARKING MAD"

[mercab]

 :

Oh my goodness, I give up on this forum. On this particular original  posting, when some of the more reasonable replies  have acknowledged that Connie´s first posting was open to mis-interpretation  ,why do some continue with their negative comments. Get a life people. We all agree that putting poison down is totally unacceptable. :head :wave :head :wave Liz

:clap: :clap: :lol: :lol:

[zilnor]

Oh my goodness, I give up on this forum. On this particular original  posting, when some of the more reasonable replies  have acknowledged that Connie´s first posting was open to mis-interpretation  ,why do some continue with their negative comments. Get a life people. We all agree that putting poison down is totally unacceptable. :head :wave :head :wave Liz

[Optomist]

Come on are you seriously suggesting she said " Is there any point in calling the Guardia Civil or the Local Police " meaning that there is no point so i might take the advice from others and use rat poison .

I think everyone knows that it was a separate question and not related to the the statement that others use Rat poison , even that i read to be nothing more than a statement ,if she intended to do that then she wouldn't have posted , there would be no need , she would have already done so or was planning to do so .

Why is it that a post has to be taken apart and read as many ways as possible by some in the hope that something in it can be used against the poster , few of us cover all the bases when we post , we can all have our posts scrutinised if someone is determined to do so they will always find something .

[mercab]

I do not see anywhere that she suggests using or asks for a opinion about using
poison she says that she has been told about poison. If I am told the best was to  to get rid of rabbits is to shoot them does that mean to say that I agree but she does say quote. Is there any point in calling the Guardia Civil or the Local Police?

[loafer]

Having closely re-read the original post, Connie did not say that she was going to use poison, BUT that other people she had spoken to suggested it. I suspect that not being a native English speaker and obviously very tired through lack of sleep, her comments were not put as well as they could have been. I apologise to Connie for at first thinking she was, in desperation, considering poison. :wave   Apologies are also due to her from other posters who made the same mistake as I did.
As I said in a previous post on this subject, I do not know what the answer is. Barking dogs are a major problem in many parts of Spain. The Spanish appear not to hear them, and sleep through it all. But Spain is a very noisy country ! And as immigrants, we have to accept it.  :wave :wave

You may have re-read the original post but the problem seems to be down to interpretation. MamaBork's post included the sentence:

From the advises I get from people around here, apparently rat-poison is the most common way of getting peace and sleep during the night down here.

This may be just repeating ideas her friends have given her, but she doesn't discount or decry the idea or say she will not consider it. Rather it seems to be inviting opinions from Forum members as to if we think it's a good idea or not. That is exactly how it reads and you can apologise for yourself if you wish to, but are not in a position to instruct others to do the same merely because it's your conclusion.

[zilnor]

Having closely re-read the original post, Connie did not say that she was going to use poison, BUT that other people she had spoken to suggested it. I suspect that not being a native English speaker and obviously very tired through lack of sleep, her comments were not put as well as they could have been. I apologise to Connie for at first thinking she was, in desperation, considering poison. :wave   Apologies are also due to her from other posters who made the same mistake as I did.
As I said in a previous post on this subject, I do not know what the answer is. Barking dogs are a major problem in many parts of Spain. The Spanish appear not to hear them, and sleep through it all. But Spain is a very noisy country ! And as immigrants, we have to accept it.  :wave :wave

[uffington15]

It's interesting to think that in a case like this, if the so called 'victims' (the people suffering from hearing the dogs barking) did put down poison and were caught and charged, they would then be 'criminals' whilst the neighbours that let their dogs bark could only be described as anti-social.

A clear case of the boot being on the other nose.

Wouldn't that be right as laying down poison for dogs is illegal but letting dogs bark is not?

[tangles]

I FEEL THAT POSTINGS LIKE THIS PUT THE IDEA INTO PEOPLES MINDS.  IF YOU EVER SAW A DOG DIE OF RAT POISON YOU DEFINITELY WOULD NOT CONSIDER THIS IN ANY WAY OR FORM.  THE DOGS ON THE STREET DID NOT ASK TO BE BORN INTO A WORLD WHERE THEY ARE NOT WANTED AND IN SOME PLACES THEY HAVE BEEN FED METAL TACKS IN FRANKFURTERS WHICH WOULD ALSO CAUSE A VERY PAINFUL DEATH.  IF YOU WERE NOT CONSIDERING USING THE POISON WHY ASK ABOUT IT IN THE FIRST PLACE.  OFTEN WHEN PEOPLE TAKE IN STRAY DOGS BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN USED TO LIVING ON THE STREET AND BARKING WHEN THEY WANT IT IS DIFFICULT TO STOP THEM BARKING WHEN THEY ARE IN A LOVING HOME.  IT IS UP TO THE OWNERS TO TRY AND CURE THEM FROM THE BARKING.  THE SPANISH DO NOT TRY TO STOP THEM BARKING AND JUST LET THEM BARK AND BARK NOT THE DOGS FAULT.
ANYBODY THAT CONSIDERS USING POISON MUST BE SICK AND THIS SHOULD NOT BE AN OPTION AND WOULD BE A CRIMINAL OFFENCE SO PLEASE DO NOT PUT IDEAS INTO PEOPLES MINDS THAT DO NOT LIKE THE DOG SITUATION IN SPAIN.  IT HAS BEEN THE SAME FOR HUNDREDS OF YEARS AND WILL NEVER CHANGE.  LETS ALL TRY AND HELP THESE POOR ANIMALS. 

[Albondigas]

Once I've discovered WHY they are barking (are they neglected or abandoned on the property for weeks at a time with no shelter and a mouldy bit of bread for food?) then it's time to have a polite word with the owners and if that fails, notify Seprona, who should at least be able to improve the dog's quality of life.

My dogs bark, but only at people who come near or walk past the property - they don't bark because they are stressed or neglected etc

My (British) neighbour's dogs bark for absolutely no reason and constantly set my lot off, who, when they hear them barking, naturally think that there is something worth barking at and join in.

As she's an unpleasant and completely unreasonable woman who laughed at me when I broached the subject of her dogs (I offered to walk them for her as they are bored to tears and in desperate need of some exercise), we've decided to take an alternative view of the noise that her dogs make:  it may well deter any would-be burglar.

Hey, if life gives you lemons... ;D ;D ;D

[montsehighpeak]

Try again - my last two attempts at responding have disappeared.

I have every sympathy with someone who is not getting enough sleep because of a dog or dogs barking - as a dog owner it happens to me with neighbour's dogs when mine are happily snoozing in their bedroom and that is probably more frustrating.  I also tried to be as polite and sympathetic as possible in my response and that still stands, if the place doesn't suit either find another place or move to a different location.  I am a responsible dog owner, among others who posted and we do not like to hear about those who are not, whether fouling, barking or any other bad behaviour, as that reflects on the owner.  However, the suggestion to use poison is not acceptable, no matter how it was presented in the initial post.

There are avenues open to those who have problems and if they are not successful then just look at all the people in the UK who have these problems - sometimes we have to put up and shut up.  The only issues I have had here have been with Brit dog owners, not with the Spanish.  I agree that when it is very hot, as it has been this summer, the dogs will doze all day and party all night unless they have stimulus to keep them active during the day, which luckily with the kids ours do have.  They also have a strict routine, just like the kids so they know when is quiet bedtime and when it is time to go out and play.

Whatever has been said though, it was the provocative use of the word poison which caused all the uproar in the first place.  The thought is disgusting and also could harm chidren.  Nobody should be using poison unless in a controlled environment in their professional career.  Also it is illegal to poison someone's dog here and there are hefty fines, for good reason.  More worrying is the thought that someone has been advised by many to poison, I have been here for 18 months and it has never been suggested to me.  On second reading I notice it is a lack of sleep for 5 days.  Yes, not fun but maybe the dogs are barking because the house has been unoccupied and they need to get used to somebody being there?  Otherwise I suggest the poster use all the helpful advice others have posted in a agreeable fashion.

[livin-doll]

This is so true Loafer and it will be another post that will be ignored as it does not suit the earnest discussion which is taking place here....

[loafer]

It's interesting to think that in a case like this, if the so called 'victims' (the people suffering from hearing the dogs barking) did put down poison and were caught and charged, they would then be 'criminals' whilst the neighbours that let their dogs bark could only be described as anti-social.

A clear case of the boot being on the other nose.

[mercab]

Definition of advocate used as a verb.....'to speak or write in favor of; support or urge by argument or suggestion; to recommend publicly' - maybe by mentioning in posting or suggesting on a public forum?

I see that you have been looking in a dictionary but where does she do any of these.Can you not see the three question marks and she most probably did come across wrong.But does she deserve some of the remarks on here.

[montsehighpeak]

Definition of advocate used as a verb.....'to speak or write in favor of; support or urge by argument or suggestion; to recommend publicly' - maybe by mentioning in posting or suggesting on a public forum?

[sparra]

Connie maybe its time you changed your circle of friends if they are advising you to poison animals, if you are found to be doing that you will be arrested. maybe you should move ..back to Denmark would be good.

[mercab]

Barking dogs, Guardia Civil, Rat-poison or???

That actually does read as though it is being presented as an option.

Could simply be "lost in translation", of course.. but that is how it reads to me. Whether or not that was really the intention.

To me with it seems like a question hence ??? I thought to advocate was to support.

[ramblarider]

Barking dogs, Guardia Civil, Rat-poison or???

That actually does read as though it is being presented as an option.

Could simply be "lost in translation", of course.. but that is how it reads to me. Whether or not that was really the intention.

[mercab]

Original post in title and it body of text....number of people.....????

still cannot see anyone who is advocating using poison on this forum maybe it is me has any else read this

[Elle1971]

Who me, Apache? I don't think so love. Just trying to bring some rhyme and reason into a very emotive conversation that sounds like it could all have been avoided.

Elle xx

[montsehighpeak]

Original post in title and it body of text....number of people.....????

[mercab]

I have to agree with ramblaraider and Elle......it IS noisy here, despite resembling a rural Spanish idyll in many places, and there isn't the usual 'be quiet, what will the neighbours think?' mentality, Spanish people in general are noisier and tolerate noise better than a lot of Northern Europeans (before anyone jumps on me for saying that, I said 'a lot' not 'all').  I lived in Spain twenty years ago as a single person in a big city (for three and a half years) and the noise didn't bother me one bit.....now I live down here and I do find dogs barking irritating occasionally because, like Elle, my dogs are well behaved and I like my sleep.  Also there have been supportive and helpful people giving advice on here, who do not want to poison dogs, Elle is right, deal with things in the correct way and accept any help or advice with good grace.  The noise is just life though.  I have even been blamed for somebody else's dogs barking and 'what was I going to do about it?' because they were loose on the plot next to my home barking all night when my three doggies were all fast asleep in bed, needless to say this from a Brit who was drunk, didn't realise whose dogs were barking and thankfully was only on holiday!  I didn't have dogs in the UK, simply because I was out of the house for a minimum of 12 hours each day (also my partner is not particularly keen on dogs but is a very responsible pet owner and was horrified when he saw this post last night about a possible threat to lay poison).  Now I am fortunate to work mainly from home and if I am not home someone else normally is, if not then the dogs (3 rescue dogs) are in the house and quiet, unless somebody approaches our gates when they will bark until that person or persons leave or we intervene. Some people are not so fortunate and have to leave their dogs to happily run around on their plot during the day while they are working.  Of course our well behaved dogs do bark sometimes, they do their job of telling us if somebody is near our home and we immediately go out to see what the issue is.  They bark rarely, as we live in a place where not many people pass.  When somebody they know and trust is there they do not bark, unless they are overexcited about the visitor who is more than likely bearing treats.  They are always walked on a lead and we carry bags and disinfectant to clear up any mess, although we schedule walks not to coincide with toilet time (I wish everyone who had dogs around here could do that, but that is another subject for another day!).  As well as 3 dogs we have 2 cats, one brought over from the UK and one abandoned here which we initially fostered and then kept.  Fortunately both our cats are house cats, but lots of our neighbours have cats wandering around who could pick up poison if it was placed.  It is worth remembering that whether you are an animal lover or not, placing poison puts human beings and in particular, children at risk and you will be breaking the law.  Could all of you who advocate using poison live with yourselves if a child died as a result of this?  Not only a death, but an agonising one - we recently saw a friend's dog die and it was not a pleasant experience for any of us. I am sure the moderators are keeping a keen eye on who does advocate breaking the law, as are the rest of us who wish to integrate into this society and live alongside our Spanish hosts. Moving home is not easy, but surely if you are so unhappy, you could research and speak to friends to find somewhere quieter?  Maybe a village house would be better in terms of no dog noise, but then you would have the human noise.  Other than that, perhaps somewhere in the middle of nowhere where only the wild/stray dogs will trouble you in the night, but no nice Spanish neighbours to help you if you had an hour of need.  I would think about what Elle said, do you really intend to say what you have? Ultimately if you are not happy, then the solution is to move away, not to try to change the area you have moved into to suit your requirements.  As my partner (who can be blunt) says often after speaking to other immigrants 'if you don't like it, go back to where you came from' blunt but honest.  I honestly hope you find peace and quiet wherever you decide to stay.  Gill x

Could all of you who advocate using poison live with yourselves What forum is this on I must go and read it.

[montsehighpeak]

I have to agree with ramblaraider and Elle......it IS noisy here, despite resembling a rural Spanish idyll in many places, and there isn't the usual 'be quiet, what will the neighbours think?' mentality, Spanish people in general are noisier and tolerate noise better than a lot of Northern Europeans (before anyone jumps on me for saying that, I said 'a lot' not 'all').  I lived in Spain twenty years ago as a single person in a big city (for three and a half years) and the noise didn't bother me one bit.....now I live down here and I do find dogs barking irritating occasionally because, like Elle, my dogs are well behaved and I like my sleep.  Also there have been supportive and helpful people giving advice on here, who do not want to poison dogs, Elle is right, deal with things in the correct way and accept any help or advice with good grace.  The noise is just life though.  I have even been blamed for somebody else's dogs barking and 'what was I going to do about it?' because they were loose on the plot next to my home barking all night when my three doggies were all fast asleep in bed, needless to say this from a Brit who was drunk, didn't realise whose dogs were barking and thankfully was only on holiday!  I didn't have dogs in the UK, simply because I was out of the house for a minimum of 12 hours each day (also my partner is not particularly keen on dogs but is a very responsible pet owner and was horrified when he saw this post last night about a possible threat to lay poison).  Now I am fortunate to work mainly from home and if I am not home someone else normally is, if not then the dogs (3 rescue dogs) are in the house and quiet, unless somebody approaches our gates when they will bark until that person or persons leave or we intervene. Some people are not so fortunate and have to leave their dogs to happily run around on their plot during the day while they are working.  Of course our well behaved dogs do bark sometimes, they do their job of telling us if somebody is near our home and we immediately go out to see what the issue is.  They bark rarely, as we live in a place where not many people pass.  When somebody they know and trust is there they do not bark, unless they are overexcited about the visitor who is more than likely bearing treats.  They are always walked on a lead and we carry bags and disinfectant to clear up any mess, although we schedule walks not to coincide with toilet time (I wish everyone who had dogs around here could do that, but that is another subject for another day!).  As well as 3 dogs we have 2 cats, one brought over from the UK and one abandoned here which we initially fostered and then kept.  Fortunately both our cats are house cats, but lots of our neighbours have cats wandering around who could pick up poison if it was placed.  It is worth remembering that whether you are an animal lover or not, placing poison puts human beings and in particular, children at risk and you will be breaking the law.  Could all of you who advocate using poison live with yourselves if a child died as a result of this?  Not only a death, but an agonising one - we recently saw a friend's dog die and it was not a pleasant experience for any of us. I am sure the moderators are keeping a keen eye on who does advocate breaking the law, as are the rest of us who wish to integrate into this society and live alongside our Spanish hosts. Moving home is not easy, but surely if you are so unhappy, you could research and speak to friends to find somewhere quieter?  Maybe a village house would be better in terms of no dog noise, but then you would have the human noise.  Other than that, perhaps somewhere in the middle of nowhere where only the wild/stray dogs will trouble you in the night, but no nice Spanish neighbours to help you if you had an hour of need.  I would think about what Elle said, do you really intend to say what you have? Ultimately if you are not happy, then the solution is to move away, not to try to change the area you have moved into to suit your requirements.  As my partner (who can be blunt) says often after speaking to other immigrants 'if you don't like it, go back to where you came from' blunt but honest.  I honestly hope you find peace and quiet wherever you decide to stay.  Gill x

[ramblarider]

The simple fact is that Spain is a noisy place, at least if you live in or close to a Spanish village. It is not just dogs, but fiestas that play loud music until 8.00 am in the morning... fireworks... guns...scooters and motorcycles.... all kinds of things that you would not expect in Scandinavia or in the UK. It is a different culture.

Your options:

1) Get used to it;
2) Move to somewhere away from the noise.

As you are only renting, that would be your best option. Find a villa or finca without neighbours, well outside of a village. Only then will you have peace and quiet. Most of the time, anyway.....

It is just the way it is here. It is Spain. Not Denmark. You will not change it. To avoid such problems, research is required in advance. Get to know how things are in a particular place....

[Elle1971]

Mamabork - I am far from a drama queen and I hope you are not referring to me!

Personally, I would never consider poison as an option - whereas you asked if it was an choice in the title of your post, and said you had been told such by a number of people. It is possible that the people you have spoken to offline were being ironic in their replies to you... and you have misunderstood the tone as a "black and white" response. Hey, we've all done it when speaking out of our own language. If you did not mean poison as a viable option, then perhaps you should have spoken to English speaking friends before posting in a certain way in a forum full of dog lovers, to ensure your tone was not quite so contentious. I have 3 large dogs who do not bark. However... I have seen what poison does to dogs - it got my back up and I'm so laid back I'm almost horizontal. You used it as an option in the title of this post. It was always going to get reactions.

I fully appreciate that lack of sleep must be massively frustrating. However... rather than coming in and making sweeping statements in this thread as a response... perhaps you should also look at those posters who have tried to help you on this thread... rather than coming in with a third post that is full of aggression, and perhaps sarcasm (unless of course you are being black and white now). Politeness and respect cost nothing... and there are a number of posters on this thread who have been very polite and respectful to your situation and have tried to help. A thank you to them would have been nice in addition to the scathing words you have shoved in to encompass everyone. You only thanked Mercab (and rightly so, for sticking up for you) but others have offered you genuine caring advice and alternatives.

When I am on a foreign language forum, and felt the need to vent... I speak to a native speaker and check I am not opening a can of worms first. I really feel that you would have saved yourself a bucketload of headache had you done the same. I post on a number of Spanish fora... and ALWAYS check my tone if posting about anything potentially contentious. Some things simply don't translate. Brits simply speak differently to mainland Europeans... and perhaps that is where this has all gone wrong.

I hope you escape the barking... but would recommend that you look at who has tried to help you instead of reacting to things sweepingly.

Elle x

[MamaBork]

I know connie, firstly she is danish and also a animal lover.  She has never said she would poison any dogs, she stated what advice she had been given, then asked if there was any point in calling the police.  To those who have danish friends who do not write like connie, maybe they should take english lessons.  Connie speaks a few languages and most probably more spanish than the majority of you lot on here.I really get p----d off with some of the replies from people on here who either cannot read or do not read posts  properly.

Thanks Mercab.......


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------   

It was my plan to answer to all the replies, but now I just want to thank you all for the psychologically profile of me - - it feels like all you Drama-queens have known me all my life - amazing, will save me a lot of money by a therapist..   :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :lol:

The reason I asked for OTHER OPTIONS, than Guardia or poison, is be course I don't like these options more than you do - or did you all miss that.

So I am very very sorry, that I tried to ask a question in a public forum, without being able to write in the same easy understandably and very well behaved manner, as all of you - I am so sorry, hopefully it wont happen again..... 

I WROTE THIS VERY SLOWLY, SO HOPEFULLY YOU WILL BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT I WROTE - OR TRY TO READ IT AGAIN - THANKS... 


PS. Thanks for the PM - very useull....    :handshake